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Ohio

I was wanting to take a little survey on what brands of Mycorrhizal that you have used, and when you was using that Mycorrhizal brand have you ever had any stumps problems, particularly the white foaming stumps?

Although this is just a shot in the dark and it probably might not make a difference on which brand you use because there are other factors out there that we think that are causing these foamers, particularly to much water traveling through the stump at one time,, but im just curious to see some numbers on the brands of Mycorrhizal that was used and did you have foamers when using the product .
I used RTI last year and did have the best root growth I have ever had using thier product. But on the down side,,I did end up with 80% of my stumps being foamers.

Now could it be that the RTI product is so good at producing such massive amounts of roots on our plants that its just might be way to many roots sucking up massive amounts of water for our vines to handle thats causing these foamers?

The Bio Endo plus I used for about three years before I started used the RTI, and I can honestly say I havent lost but maybe 1 stump (and it wasn't really a white foamer) growing in the 3 years, and I grow at least 10 plants a year.
But I will say from my experience using the Bio Endo Plus Mycorrhizal I didnt get near the root growth that I had using the RTI Mycorrhizal.

So whats your guys findings in using different types of Mycorrhizal, and which brand was you using or not using when getting a foaming stump? (NOTE; Im not saying Mycorrhizal causes foamers 100%, but could it help contribute or prevent them?)

1/31/2010 7:35:54 AM

Anamosa, IA [email protected]

I have never had foaming stump problems, but I have had severe root rot on the vine roots. Last year I used Espoma Starter Plus with mycorrhizae and several species of beneficial bacteria and organic starter fertilizer on 6 of our 8 plants. It was in the potting mix and at most of the leaf-root nodes. All 8 of our plants were also treated with Aliette. Even with a super wet summer and an August flash flood, none of the treated plants showed any signs of the root rot problem. One untreated plant did have it before the flood. The other untreated plant that didn't get the rot was on a sandy spot. Maybe it was the addition of the beneficial bacteria that prevented the disease problem. It convinced me to use the Espoma or a similar product with the micorrhizae and bacteria on all my plants from now on. Maybe the bacteria might help with foaming stump problems, as they are supposed to produce natural antibiotics.

1/31/2010 9:59:54 AM

Ohio

Iowegian,
The thing about these foaming stumps is that the roots are always snow white and very healthy looking when the stumps start to foam, so root rot has never been my problem, its always been the stumps that are lost and nothing else. If you dont get your stumps off when they are looking really bad it will move up your main rather quickly.

1/31/2010 1:38:35 PM

Jericho Vermont

I have been using Myc. on all of my plants (tblespoon per leaf node) for last two years and have not had a foamer. I usually averaged one foamer a year before that. Not sure if it is because of the myco or it was soil/weather/genetics related. I have found that smaller stumps with a greenish color stay healthier than big ole tan ones but not sure what causes all of this. Although I have assumed it is more of a soil born condition due to the fact my foamers have all been around the same location in the patch.
John

1/31/2010 2:50:03 PM

Ohio

John, what brand of Mycorrhizal was you using the last 2 years that you never had problems?,, was you using RTI or Endo Plus?

Im with you on that John, the smaller stumps I have never had a problem with the foamers, its always the bigger size stumps is when I have seen the foamers.

I have had some monster stumps over the years that has never foamed on me, some of my biggest I have every grown myself, but they was the stumps I used the Endo on in the planting hole.

1/31/2010 3:09:56 PM

Saegertown Pa.

I have used both RTI and Endo plus and have seen no difference, I have had foamers with both. In my patch Mycorrhizal doesn't seem to help with the foamers.

1/31/2010 3:22:03 PM

Ohio

All this could be just coincidence with my foamers, and I know there is alot more to these foamers that we dont know about, alot more.

To the old time growers out there, that has grown more then 8 to 10 years,(like Lack Larue, Chris Lyons, Dills, Eaton, Holland,, etc, etc,,,, how much talk did you hear about these foaming stumps back when you started growing like we are hearing about them today , like over the past 5 years?

I really haven't heard much talk about these foamers untill 4 or 5 years ago. Each year it seems to be getting worse and not better, but that also might be because there is alot more growers growing pumpkins now to where its noticed alot more?

Really all Im doing is taking a shot with my eyes closed here, just trying to get a rough idea on what you guys have run into using certain Mycorrhizal products in the past.

Its just something Ron Wallace and I have (more Ron then me,) have been researching trying to figure out how to slow these foamers down some.
Lots of different things are going to be experimented with in Ron's patch and mine this year on water flow going through the stump, like different vine patterns and things, hopefully something we try works on a consistent basis, that will help everyone out.
No secrets from me thats for sure, If Ron or I find something that works we will let you know,,LOL!!

1/31/2010 3:31:44 PM

Ohio

thanks Quinn.

1/31/2010 3:32:46 PM

Jericho Vermont

Brooks,
I am an equal opportunist, Endo plus two years ago and RTI last year. Really didn't see much of a difference with either. What I did notice with using any Myco is that the plants looked healthier in the miserable weather conditions of the last two years. Way too wet in 2008 and too wet and very cool here in 2009. So I would like to put in a warm dry summer request for Ma nature in 2010!!!!!!!!

1/31/2010 3:39:02 PM

Adams County

Has anybody cut off a piece of stump and sent it to a lab and had it checked out, might be able to tell if its ( chemical , fungal, bacterial or somthing on that line. wild guess but might be something worth trying. maybe at the levels of ferts and amendments were using is causing a reaction.not sure just throwing this out there..

1/31/2010 3:55:47 PM

Ohio

Yea Bill, couple growers have sent the foamers into for testing.

both results came back as 'no desease found'.

1/31/2010 4:28:49 PM

South Hero, VT

Check out the General Discussion 1/5/2010 "put a lid on mr. foamy"

1/31/2010 5:11:53 PM

Iowa

Could it be that the myco. has increased the root mass to a point where uptake into the plant is now above 10 times what it used to be? More uptake more fluid,more fluid more chance of a blow out and then foam... Could one also say that weather slows and speeds up the movement of that fluid off and on down the plant? Just my 2 cents.

1/31/2010 6:59:30 PM

Ohio

little diffrent discusion VTMonkey,, just a tad bit diffrent.

Krug, did you read my 1st post on here!,,lol.

''Now could it be that the RTI product is so good at producing such massive amounts of roots on our plants that its just might be way to many roots sucking up massive amounts of water for our vines to handle thats causing these foamers?''

1/31/2010 7:57:14 PM

Ohio

Oh I see what your talking about VT, I seen that post I think, that the one Pap did?

1/31/2010 8:00:03 PM

South Hero, VT

Yep, the one about what can be done to prevent the foaming stumps--myco may not be the problem all of the time.

1/31/2010 9:03:10 PM

Paradise Mountain, New York

I use Mycorrhizal from Joe Holland all the time. I have massive roots the size of my finger. I've never had a foamy stump since I started growing in 2002. In all the researching I have done, Mycorrhizal is Mycorrhizal. Plus the guy who products Mycorrhizal were Joe Holland gets his,has more years of research then anyone in the world on Mycorrhizal.

1/31/2010 9:10:38 PM

Gold Hill, Oregon

i used rti and had no foaming.

2/6/2010 12:11:12 AM