From

Location

Message

Date Posted

[email protected]

Sitting down with a fellow grower last week and discussed the future of seed exchanges with the top growers or "Heavy Hitters". With all of the jokes in recent board exchanges about sending 3 bucks to a grower, and also keeping other discussions in mind about "seed hoarders" and how they accumulate and then ultimately control top seeds for thier own use we have come to the following conclusions what will happen.

1. Instead of the tradional seed collections being 1000 plus in all for each grower at thier house, the options may end up being the following in the future. The obvious options will be seed auctions, seed raffles, and club promos and distributions. All 3 of these options are from the HH's and come at a price, whether it be club memberships, promo prices, or auction prices. THe profit goes to the clubs, not individual growers.

2. The second option after club profits is the old fashioned bubble. With all the hubbub over HH's getting hundreds of bubbles each year, they could take control of their top quality stock by only sending seeds to a grower who "promises" to show that seed dirt. With that promise the heavy hitter then can keep track of who, where, and how each seed has been treated and has done during the year. THe extra 200 or so seeds then would be in the HH's control instead of bubble exchanges to people they hardly know.

12/21/2008 11:13:19 AM

[email protected]

I guess the bottom line to a future of HH control is up to them. I figure instead of cherishing 3 898 Knauss's in hand Len probably should have sent one to each person who promised to grow it the following year instead of sending out that extra 200 (after club distributions/auctions/raffles) and having no control over his own stock. This way the following year he still had the extra seeds and could send another one to clubs or whomover.

Is this clear what I am trying to say? I found this year I wanted a top notch seed and thought there was no way to get it. I sent the HH a letter expressing my intentions and promised it would see dirt and low and behold a week later it was there. That is how I would like to do my business instead of trying to deal with a second hand exchange of the seed through a grower in Ishpeming Michigan (no offense to Ishpeming residents).

Comments?

12/21/2008 11:13:28 AM

Midway, UT

All I know is that I am very grateful to at least one heavy hitter that I met at a weight off back east that actually offered me a proven seed of his without me even asking and then ended up sending me two proven seeds from two of his proven plants in the bubble. I will give both of those seeds dirt with gratitude.

I'm not going to answer for anyone else but if I had the problems of a heavy hitter (and I wish some day that I do) I would build myself a little website that would help me manange the requests and the distribution of the seeds. That way I could streamline the requests, print lables quickly and all at once, track where the seeds went and how they have done and have some control over my seeds. I might even sell a small percentage of the seeds directly through the website. The rest of the seeds I would distribute to the local grower groups to help them raise funds and do with as they see best.

If any grower would like to hear more about the website and how it might work please let me know. I know not everyone could build a website like this but it might work.

12/21/2008 11:59:28 AM

Brooklyn Corner, Nova Scotia

Rock I'm not sure where you're going. It seems like you're suggesting that HH only send out seeds to people who promise to plant them. I didn't see any hubub over HH sending out bubbles. Quinn's post was self explanatory and only four or five HH offered any comments. The bubble post started by Brooks was aimed at only one guy. Like you I sent a HH an e-mail requesting a seed. If the answer had been no, then I would simply consider another choice. You sent the letter and got the seed you wanted so what am I missing?. The number of HH in North America and Europe is getting larger and will continue to grow. To be honest, I can see a time when only the cream of the crop HH like Quinn and a few others will have difficulty filling seed requests.

Two sentences in your post caught my attention" I guess the bottom line to a future of HH control is up to them". That's 100% true, and each can decide what is right for them. The second " That is how I would like to do my business instead of trying to deal with a second hand exchange of the seed through a grower in Ishpeming Michigan (no offense to Ishpeming residents)." I honestly don't know what the last sentence refers to, maybe you could elaborate.

12/21/2008 12:41:03 PM

ordinary,VA

think its the fun factor of collecting seeds when you first get into growing giants.than you hooked like collecting baseball cards..
than you realize hey someone might want to growing one of these seeds.

Rock you were my first (person to send me a bubble :) years ago. and helped me with every "dumb" question i could come up with..

the great generosity of growers HH if you will never fails to amaze me.most times HH will send what they can to help .. once ask Joe Pukos if i could send one of the seeds he sent me off to another grower..Joe's reply: "once i give them to you, there yours to do with what you please".(cant wait to get the 1102 in the dirt-Thanks Joe).

I have passed along "hot seeds" to growers when i can to help them out and have had seeds sent to me out of the blue (Thanks Owen for the 1250Kline) from growers just because..

not being a HH myself I cannot imagine what the top hitters go through(would like to image one day) but I'm sure thank full for there kindness,knowledge & seeds!!

man i love growing these things!!!!!

12/21/2008 1:03:44 PM

huntsburg,ohio

What i think I'm gonna do next year is only send out seeds who promise there gonna see dirt plus donate some to clubs.That way I should have plenty left for the next season should it get hot.For this year I'll send out what I can or until gone.Jerry

12/21/2008 1:51:28 PM

Ohio

I think doing it the way Jerry is saying, and I think thats the way Quinn is doing it this year also, it will give more growers out there more of a chance of growing the seed they want to grow.
Cause you figure, if they send out 200 seeds to growers and that next year only 20 is planted, you still have about 180 seeds out there in seed land, but even though there is that many seed out there it now makes it harder for growers to find that seed they want to grow
If the original grower had just held onto that extra 180 seeds that was not planted it would have made it alot easier for the grower who really wanted to grow it now. All ya got to do is just email the grower and ask him for one.(Hope that makes sense,lol)

I used to believe send em all out and more chances for your seed to be grown, but now Im not such a firm believer in that anymore.

12/21/2008 2:32:37 PM

Boise City, Oklahoma, USA

If you grow a good one, you're going to get attention. I feel that you should ask the grower first before sending that bubble. If they say no, be gracious. If you do send the bubble it might not get filled, and that's okay too. Hope for next year and understand why it might not have gotten filled.

Growers in general are a great bunch; how seed gets around has a few faults but. I'm grateful for generosity shown my way, and have tried to send it on.

Seed trading/brokering/supply seems to work well enough most of the time, but.

Only thing I see as something that will need to be addressed is the apparent rise of 'counterfeit seed' in some places at some times and sometimes through the same source. How to tell what you have in your hand from whatever source, is what it claims to be? And make it easy and inexpensive to do and accessable to all....

12/21/2008 2:37:06 PM

Port Alberni, BC, Canada

As a "HH", I must always remind myself that I'm just an ordinary guy that loves to see how big I can grow the next pumpkin. I must also remind myself that I owe my success to the kindness and support of other growers and the free advice from people like Howard Dill.

Yes, there's a lot of work filling seed requests but it makes me feel good to send seed all over this world. It is always hoped that the seed I send will see dirt but once a seed is sent, it belongs to the addressee and can be done with as he/she wishes.

My home club always has first dibs on seed for their fund raisers. After that, all requests will be considered individually and on availability of seed. Seed counts may be low so not all requests can be met.

I very seldom ask for a specific seed from specific growers but when I do, those seeds will see dirt because they fit in with the crosses I want to make.

Just my $0.02 worth.

12/21/2008 2:41:59 PM

Jericho Vermont

I think one of the reasons that our hobby has survived and grown is because of the generosity of all growers to share their seeds with those courteous enough to send a bubble with a return postage and a nice note. I am assuming most growers out there are not going to be able to spend hundreds of dollars on seeds. I have truly appreciated my seed trades for the past 7 or 8 years with HH growers and all others. Many that I started sharing with were not HHs but have done incredibly well as of late. I understand the stress of many bubbles coming in, but I think our hobby has only gotten to where it is and will continue to grow with the generosity of all growers.
John

12/21/2008 2:48:47 PM

Mill Bay, British Columbia

Thanks Jake. I got my first seeds from Howard Dill and then was thrilled when the local Champion (yes, Jake) offered to send me and my buddies some of his seeds.

We were thrilled to say the least and since that day, have grown seeds given to us by Jake....we may not grow fruit that can compete at big weigh-offs, but almost all of us in the North Shore Boyz group of growers can thank that "HH" for their personal best grown with his seeds.

12/21/2008 2:58:03 PM

Waquoit Mass

geez i guess the genetics of a seed from a HH lol must be different than that of all the rest.plant the best seeds you can get and over time develop your own great crosses hamr

12/21/2008 4:58:18 PM

Ohio

good point there Hammr.

12/21/2008 5:41:55 PM

Upstate S.C.

First and Foremost I would like to wish everyone a very merry Christmas and a safe and I DO MEAN SAFE and happy new year. The only thing I would like to add is that I am one thankful person. I started this hobbie almost by accident, I was out of work for a period of time last year and needed something to fill the void of time. Gardening was fairly new to me and I had no idea that a year and a half later I would be so in love with growing Giant Pumpkins. When most things in my new garden didn't do so well, these little Alantic Giants seeds that I picked up at lowes just took off. I couldn't belive what I was seeing. When everything else was dying the vines on these things were growing almost a FOOT a day. I was hooked and started reading and researching everything I could get my hands on. I have always been a person to try and get answers right from the horses mouth so while I was learning I was also realizeing many things I had done wrong, so I ask many "HH's alot of questions. From Soil to seeds ect. Not one person did I ask not answer. I said all that to say this. Thank you so very much to everyone who has helped me in so way either with an answer or seed or just let me pick a brain. This new hobbie has taught me many things but I belive the most important is that there are still really great folks left in this world. Thanks again.

12/21/2008 7:34:24 PM

Okla

Rocky good topic to bring up. I have been thinking hard about this subject. With being down in the southern part of the USA I believe that there are several of us that are beginning to wonder about how we will be getting seeds in the future. With our hotter climate we can not compete with the northern growers because we do not get the huge pumpkins that they do. Therefore we do not have as much of a chance to win(compete for) the large prizes that they are able to win so they can afford to buy the clubs seeds packages where it would be more costly for us to buy without being able to get the huge pumpkins. If that becomes the only way to get the better seed stock then I see the growers who can not compete with the growers who have a huge advantage of being able to grow the bigger pumpkins STOP growing. You can already look and see that there are not a lot of deep southern growers already. Ever wonder why?

12/21/2008 8:54:34 PM

Okla

Then again I see with there becoming so many growers with more new ones starting to grow every year that there has to be a change of some type in the way HH send there seeds out. I hope that it becomes like you said that they will only send them out with the promise that it will be planted in the coming year. There are not enough seeds in a pumpkin to keep sending out to all the growers out there now. I just hope that the way seeds are sent out does not become a money type issue because there will be a decrease of growers in the climates that can not compete with the better climates. YEAH I know the weights are coming up slowly in our climates,, but it is not comparable to what the northern growers are doing!
It is already discouraging to the southern growers of having to battle so hard to grow what they can in the heat and other elements caused during the hot climate we have to grow in. Reasons you do not see as many growers down our ways and the ones you do see do not last long with it being so hard.
I would love to get the high caliber seeds that grow the world records but I would be ashamed to ask for any of them for the reason I know I could never do it justice and waste such good seeds on growing a smaller pumpkin than what it has potential to grow, such as maybe a new world record. Bottom line is we are not able to compete at the level the northern growers are able to. Hopefully in the years to come that will change with all the new methods that are coming into play in regards to soil and fertilizing issues.

12/21/2008 9:08:05 PM

Joliet, IL

i appreciate all the heavy hitters seeds from the past. quinn werner and joe jutras have been very kind to me for many years filling bubble requests and i have grown both of some of their crosses in the past with great success.

as the recipient of seeds from a heavy hitter...especially in my first few years growing, it was as cool as it gets. to get involved in a sport or hobby where the best of the best players give you a chance with their generosity and their down to earth humility and advice is something you do not find in many other circles. to me, it is what makes this hobby unique from anything else i have ever been involved in. thank you pumpkin growers, heavy hitters or not, for all the seeds and friendships.

i believe the proper etiquette is to ask first for permission to send a bubble. if you are requesting for a proven seed, list your growing experience and promise the grower it will see dirt and stick to your promise. if they have an extra and send you one, great. if not, be understanding and try to pick one up in an auction if you can afford it.

as from a heavy hitters perspective, i cannot speak or pretend to know about the amount of bubbles you all receive and the work involved. it would be nice to verbalize a "BUBBLE REQUEST ETIQUETTE GUIDELINE" put together by the heavy hitters, about how they would like treated in terms of bubble requests. then place it on bp.com and send out to all clubs. each individual pumpkin seed count will determine
which seeds they need to be more conservative with when granting reuests.

generosity will always be the main ingredient in my eyes to the uniqueness of this killer thing we all like to do...grow big pumpkins...bigger than the next guy.

12/21/2008 10:21:40 PM

[email protected]

I also think the Heavy Hitters maintain quality control this way and would eliminate these ebay situations. The main reason for printing this is as Ed (Mr D and Me) stated in the younger days wanting to be a seed monger. Now that is just silly and if all we had to do was send one or two bubbles out every year for the seeds we guaranteed to grow it would be simpler.

12/21/2008 11:34:12 PM

Rhode Island

while some may consider it a pain in the ass ron nad i always felt that bubbles are how new growers get there start and likewise experienced growers exchange seeds.
its certainly how we got started. sending a bubble and a note to each grower we requested a seed from.

ya cant expect to get your seeds planted if you dont get them out there. we are not talking gold here. its just a friggin pumpkin seed.

yes there will always be a certain percentage of growers who will be bubble pigs. these are the same people who fill their plates so full at a buffet that they need side boards just to get back to the table. they are in a minority.

most growers will only request a few seeds that they want to pick from or have in their bank. we all have a seed bank dont we? how do you think we got it?

on the flip side many growers do not want the extra work of filling bubbles especially if they know many will never see dirt unless it becomes proven. i can see their point as well.

its just a matter of choice.

pap

12/22/2008 5:32:48 AM

Brooklyn Corner, Nova Scotia

Well said Pap.

12/22/2008 7:24:12 AM

Cameron,ontario Team Lunatic

I like the idea of distributing seeds through your local club (either sale or as a promotion to sign up members). I know many growers belong to several groups (I have 6 or more, I think). It's a good way to get the seeds your looking for & not look like a seed monger. It also gets your seeds into the hands of others in hopes it gets planted. We donated enough seeds from our 3 pumpkins to give every club member a seed from each. I usually donate anything I can't grow to the GVGO for future raffles, to fellow members looking for a specific seed or to other clubs for their auctions. I do send a seed pack to about 30 growers each year that always send me their seeds & a GVGO pack to the other clubs. It's a good way to guarantee that your friends will have one of your seeds or other clubs have one, just in case it becomes very hot. For new growers on the scene, I suggest to join a club & get a big bag of quality seeds. You can't go wrong.

Phil

12/22/2008 8:29:12 AM

Murfreesboro, TN, USA

Here is something interesting that I had never considered. I am a new grower that enjoys all the trials and tribulations that go along with this hobby/sport. From wondering if my seed will germinate, to transplanting the seedlings in the ground, to watching that fruit get bigger everyday and hoping that it doesn't split open. It is fun, but I never had considered asking a HH for a seed, I didn't think I would be worthy of receiving a seed because my successes have been small, but also I am only a beginner.

I figure I need to pay my dues and I have bought some seeds from seed auctions and received some seeds from those who have advertised that they were giving some seeds away, but a seed from a "HH" no way, who am I to ask for one of these? I would consider myself a long shot to prove whether a "HH" seed is going to become proven in my garden?

If the tables were turned, I would trade with a few of my friends, but I think I would turn my attention to those who are like me and are trying to reach that 500 lb mark. I think that is what I am realizing about this sport; it seems that "HH" remember what it was like to be a beginner! Thank you all!

12/22/2008 8:50:43 AM

ordinary,VA

Phil i agree, try to support as many clubs also.
with the awesome seed giveway the GVGO and many other clubs
offer its hard not to build a massive seed bank..at our winter meeting I take all my seeds and pass them along.

in my opinion what makes Giant Pumpkin growing so incredible addicting and fun is the wiliness of HH to open there "playbook" so to speak .with the Knowledge & seeds they give you the chance to be HH as well. the help form HH you can now save years of trial and era with just a email or a post on this great site.."Here's the seed, here's how to grow it, now go out and out grow me"

in the end it's up to each HH to do what he or she wants to do.

12/22/2008 10:28:26 AM

[email protected]

After reading thru most of these posts, I can see the points made about seed requests for Heavy Hitters and the hundreds and hundreds of requests they must get in a season. I think it was said best when they agreed it should be up to the individual on how they want to handle the seed request.

My first two years of growing were terrible, and I had no idea on how to dry seeds properly plus only growing 256 and 275 pound pumpkins the first two years, I really didn't have any good quality seeds. So for me, last year, receiving bubbles was (and still is) like Christmas in the mail every day, and very much appreciated.

I still think the Self Addressed Stamped Bubble is the easiest way to go, and if you need to put a few bucks in to cover the growers postage, it's still a good value.

The other option is the clubs. The NYSGPGA offers a very good seed distribution (shameless plug) for those that are looking for seeds. And it's a good way to get your unknown seed out there to growers.

12/22/2008 10:40:07 AM